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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
update:


This topic is wasted - the parts turn out to be special and there are no aftermarket parts available so just buy from Yamaha.





For the Middle Drive Gear -Item #78 - has anyone identified after-market fasteners for Item #79 and Item #80, ormaybe has anyone sketched and dimensioned them (thread/pitch, how thick, ID OD etc) to identify them in the fastener store?


The view below is the newer version (Yami page for 2008 shown).
 

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Did I miss something? Did Yami come up with the answer to the front pulley problem for all years? Please respond-as this issue has worried me for quite some time! I have been inspecting my pulley about every other gas fill up!
 

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Re: Middle Drive Gear Question - 1st

Arizona Warrior said:
For the Middle Drive Gear -Item #78 - has anyone identified after-market fasteners for Item #79 and Item #80, ormaybe has anyone sketched and dimensioned them (thread/pitch, how thick, ID OD etc) to identify them in the fastener store?

[*]'02-05' : 22mm Thd x 1.5p x M36 HexSocket
[*]'06' & > : 22mm Thd x 1.5p x ** M32M30 Hex Socket - Your model year differences show M30 nut which is correct!** i believe is incorrect but i've been wrong before.** EDITED **[/list]


The view below is the newer version (Yami page for 2008 shown). I have a 2003(tabbed washer)and Yami indicates these newer fasteners are the correct replacement parts even for earlier years. I don't have 'em so can't just match 'em up!

[*]This is not accurate information as the early middle shaft is shorter and will not accomodate the longerStake/Dimple Pulley Nut used on the later models ('06' & >)
[*]Just as a reference and confirmation of the above,the National Recall Campaign for the CPS specifically differentiated between these frt pulley parts forDealer awareness.[/list]These newer Yami part numbers are:


91719-22006-00 Nut


90208-22002-00 Conical Spring Washer


Thanks!

Later assembly shown below with Yamaha adapter plate for naked pulley


 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Thanks, I'll use22mm Thd x 1.5p x M36 HexSocket with a 22mm conical spring washer for my 2003. Maybe Grainger handles them that would make it easy. I've added the data you provided to the Feb 1st update of model year differences post.


This will not work. Itsnot a standard nut and washer. Its special stuff. Those reading this in the future, just buy from Yami until someone locates another source if ever!
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
The fastener houses we work with have come back negative on these items. They appear to be used for kick-start assemblies and some large tooling but those items don't give enough detail to know if they are the rightOD and capacity.


The items of standard manufacture seem to be:


Thesteel/zinc 22mm conical spring washer has a 39mm OD which might be too large (will check on disassembly but prefer to be prepared!).


The standard 22mm nut with 1.5p has 32mm hex and is a whopping 18mm thick (Class 8 Zinc).


The heavy 22mm nut with 36mm hex is 2.5p and a slim ~3mm thick (.119") (Class 10 Zinc forauto/machinery) and has more capacity but the wrong pitch.


Question: I'm out of sources - including checking across the web. Has anyone actually found these items in the aftermarket or are we locked into the dealer (so should buy in advance even if maybe not needed at time of work)?
 

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Arizona Warrior said:
Question: I'm out of sources - including checking across the web. Has anyone actually found these items in the aftermarket or are we locked into the dealer (so should buy in advance even if maybe not needed at time of work)?

Because they are rather "special" fasteners, Yamaha will be the easy way to go. The Yamaha parts hold up well, when installed properly.


You never told us thereason for your parts quest. You planning to replace the shaft? Or just in case the nut comes loose?
 

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Re: Middle Drive Gear Question - 2nd

Arizona Warrior said:
Question: I'm out of sources - including checking across the web. Has anyone actually found these items in the aftermarket or are we locked into the dealer (so should buy in advance even if maybe not needed at time of work)?
IMO, you're spinning your wheels and possiblytreadingwater with your intended combination of parts unless you ride your bike like a pu$$y



Fact: The early frt pulley nut is a proprietary partnot only w/the larger M36 hex but is also machined on its face (c'bored)to accommodate the slightprotrusion of the splined middle shaft which is 30mm OD. The splined tabbed washer is designed as a safety feature to restrain the nut if it comes loose notthread lockthat many users have used for a band-aid repair of worn parts!


Suggest you review this thread in its entirety: http://rswarrior.com/forums/p/26783/286675.aspx#286675including this: http://rswarrior.com/forums/p/26783/386425.aspx#386425


NOTE: If thelate conical washer doesn't fit over the30mm middle shaftyou'll get a false tightening of the assembly depending upon the thickness of the Yamaha adapter plate for thenaked pulley ifusing that assembly. You'll also lose thd engagement because of the thicker conical washer which is counter productiveif using theadapterandyou'll have no protection w/o the tab washer....


Dorman Productspobably has a matching crush spindle nut that will work withthe newly designed middle shaft assy similar to the enclosed






EDITED: Early parts shown below for reference- Click on Photos to Enlarge










Here’s a Club you might be interested in joining: [url]http://rswarrior.com/forums/t/13277.aspx[/url]
They even sell a patch for your leather vest!
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
I'm after the nut in case the existing one gets screwed up on removal, and I want to use a new washer since mine has the old tabbed washer which can be difficult to re-use unless I get lucky enough that the one remaining fresh tab falls close enough to bend neara flat of the nut. So its really a preventive measure. I want them on-hand at time of disassembly for clean-up, and for this:





Bladerunr said:
You never told us thereason for your parts quest. You planning to replace the shaft? Or just in case the nut comes loose?
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
I'm guessing since Yami has one newconical spring washer part# to replace the tabbed washer on earlybikes, anda differentpart#for thepart on the 06+ bikes, maybeit'll beokay.I'll keep a sharp eye out for this condition just in case the incorrect model year washer is shipped.


AlanH said:
NOTE: If thelate conical washer doesn't fit over the30mm middle shaftyou'll get a false tightening of the assembly depending upon the thickness of the Yamaha adapter plate for thenaked pulley ifusing that assembly. You'll also lose thd engagement because of the thicker conical washer which is counter productiveif using theadapterandyou'll have no protection w/o the tab washer....
 

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Re: Middle Drive Gear Question - 3rd

Arizona Warrior said:
The view below is the newer version (Yami page for 2008 shown). I have a 2003(tabbed washer)and Yami indicates these newer following fasteners are the correct replacement parts even for earlier years. I don't have these newer part#'s on my OEM '03so I can't just match 'em up!


These newer Yami part numbers are: (updated)


02-05 Nut is # 90179-22004-00


02-05 Conical Spring Washer is # 90215-26241-00 (new #)


06-08 Nut is # 91719-22006-00


06-08 Conical Spring Washer is # 90208-22002-00
Arizona Warrior said:
I'm guessing since Yami has one newconical spring washer part# to replace the tabbed washer on earlybikes, anda differentpart#for thepart on the 06+ bikes, maybeit'll beokay.I'll keep a sharp eye out for this condition just in case the incorrect model year washer is shipped.

I just can’t help but marvel where you get this information or is it an assumption?
.. ...
Why would Yamaha ever eliminate the safetylock washer anduse a conical washer when there would be no provisions to secure the earlierpulley nut?. .. As stated much earlier, the later bikes ('06' & >)have a longer middle shaft and a notch to dimple the newly designed nut and conical washer.


Yamaha reverted back (Superceded) to the earlier lock washer used on the 2002 Warrior 90215-26241-00. The 2003-2005 Warrior models used a later washer, 90215-30233-00 shown in RH Photo, which was obvious problematic.


Here are some take-off parts shown below: The lower washer, in the LH photo,with the corrosion was purchased back in Nov 04 when I replaced my failed middle shaft and pulley: Sprocket Issue's (anyone else? http://rswarrior.com/forums/p/20832/324166.aspx#324166Taken from that referenced thread and my observation and opinion at the time:
“IMHO the factory torque of 72ft/lbs was not enough force to tighten the pulley properly because of the design of the original retaining washer. The replacement washer is a different mat'l and design.”


The upper washer, in the LH photo,& the one currently on my bike was purchased, 12-28-06, when I did the DIY 240 mod & 33T frt Road* pulley. Notice the PN’s and dating on the package!


Conclusion:
Yamaha reverted back (superceded) to the earlier tabbed lock washer used on the 2002 Warrior (90215-26241-00 LH Photo). The 2003-2005 Warrior models used 90215-30233-00, RH Photo,which is now superceded. Interestingly, the same supersession affected the Road* models using the 1700cc engine
and earlier 1600cc Road* use the 90215-26241-00 in theLH Photo.


Maybe this will clarify your myth of the new Conical Spring Washer for the earlier ’02-05’ Warrior models
Click on Photos to Enlarge - RH Photo of Superceded PN 90215-30233-00
[/b]
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Yep. It figures I even thanked you for nothing. Re-reading everything I can see how it happened.


Arizona Warrior said:
Thanks, I'll use22mm Thd x 1.5p x M36 HexSocket with a 22mm conical spring washer for my 2003.

From the beginningit was clearI was asking about aftermarket availability and its now obvious you already knew it wasn't available in the aftermarket, but you let me spend precious time searching anyway. I let that slide since it seemed likely it was simply a lack of communication, a misunderstanding, and besides what if I stumbled across something new since the last guy searched.


Now its obvious you knew it was back to being a tabbed washer when I'd been saying conical because I believed that yousaid conical.Its sorta funny actually, hindsight is 20/20. I see now how we both mis-interpreted each other. That's okay,it wasn't intentional, but candidly Ifeel let down because it was obvious(because I said it) that I don't have any spares (yet) andI haven't popped the cap off (yet) so you reasonably knew there was no way anyone couldyet translate your hands-on information into real world terms untilgetting hands into that part of the machine. BTW nice pics, lol hehe and etc thanks for drawing me a picture.


There is one thing though.I guess Isorta felt like I was stepping out on a limb in trusting you to play nice in the event of a misunderstanding, valid because you've walked that path often. You and me, we don't communicate. Don't know why. But you sewed the seeds then posted yet another rude snippet.


It also bothers me a little that you've constantly insinuated that since you are 'hands-on' you are better than me. I've been under cars and bikes since I was 13 and I've always had fun even if mistakes were made. I never claimed to be experienced with the Warrior beyond what is posted in my gallery, andI have done all of that work myself,in my driveway, no help, except a few kind souls on this forum who I thanked as we went along. Everything else - you know I referred people to topics posted by members who have successfully done the work - and I let their words speak for them.


In that spirit, I had hoped for clear advise from those who have done this before, butI can see that's not going to happen.So I'll fly solo, with the service manual as my co-pilot and a few trusted posts filed-away inpopular mods for extra navigation. It'll be fine, it always is.


As for this topic, itsdone nothing but waste everyone's time so I'm moving on.


Let the smart-*** remarks begin . . . I truly don't care.


(added): OK,my wife said she loves herleather ride vests because they remind her about places she has seen with her knees in the breeze. Her current vest goes back to2001 when we changedriding clubs over in Arizona. Well, she said your vest remark smells like a lightly-veiled smirk of disapproval, and she said she doesn't much care what you think about vests. She asked about the link for the club you saidI might be interested in joining. Since my middle shaft hasn't failed, I don't qualify (yet) for that club.





AlanH said:
Wed, Jan 21 2009 6:40 PM


Arizona Warrior said:
Question: I'm out of sources - including checking across the web. Has anyone actually found these items in the aftermarket or are we locked into the dealer (so should buy in advance even if maybe not needed at time of work)?
IMO, you're spinning your wheels and possiblytreadingwater with your intended combination of parts unless you ride your bike like a pu$$y



Fact: The early frt pulley nut is a proprietary partnot only w/the larger M36 hex but is also machined on its face (c'bored)to accommodate the slightprotrusion of the splined middle shaft which is 30mm OD. The splined tabbed washer is designed as a safety feature to restrain the nut if it comes loose notthread lockthat many users have used for a band-aid repair of worn parts!


Suggest you review this thread in its entirety: http://rswarrior.com/forums/p/26783/286675.aspx#286675including this: http://rswarrior.com/forums/p/26783/386425.aspx#386425


NOTE: If thelate conical washer doesn't fit over the30mm middle shaftyou'll get a false tightening of the assembly depending upon the thickness of the Yamaha adapter plate for thenaked pulley ifusing that assembly. You'll also lose thd engagement because of the thicker conical washer which is counter productiveif using theadapterandyou'll have no protection w/o the tab washer....


Dorman Productspobably has a matching crush spindle nut that will work withthe newly designed middle shaft assy similar to the enclosed






EDITED: Early parts shown below for reference- Click on Photos to Enlarge







Here’s a Club you might be interested in joining: [url]http://rswarrior.com/forums/t/13277.aspx[/url]



They even sell a patch for your leather vest!
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
While on this topic I'd better post that there are reports for the '06+ models of different hex sizes for the front pulley so everyone might want to checkthe nut size on your bike before assuming you have the right socket!


Re: 06 front pulley nut size?


cmzracing wrote the following post at Thu, Mar 22 2007 4:16 AM


http://rswarrior.com/forums/p/24896/366908.aspx#366908


cmzracing said:
just measured mine on my 06 here at work, def a 30mm. dont know what brand of socket you were checking with, but i just put a Snap-On tools 30mm socket and it fit snug. if your brand socket is from like walmart those cheap brands can fit a little loose when you get up to that size nut.




AlanH wrote the following post at Tue, Jan 20 2009 7:07 PM:


AlanH said:
Arizona Warrior said:
For the Middle Drive Gear -Item #78 - has anyone identified after-market fasteners for Item #79 and Item #80, ormaybe has anyone sketched and dimensioned them (thread/pitch, how thick, ID OD etc) to identify them in the fastener store?
[*]'02-05' : 22mm Thd x 1.5p x M36 HexSocket
[*]'06' & > : 22mm Thd x 1.5p x M32Hex Socket - Your model year differences show M30 nut which i believe is incorrect but i've been wrong before.[/list]
 

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FRONT PULLEY NUT

I wasn’t sure how to reply to Arizona Warriors emotional and finger pointing post in this open forum w/o fueling the fire so I decided to wait several days before responding to this foolishness.


I’m not looking for members to take sides nor do I wish any member to respond to my rebuttal here. If you have the need to reply please do so in a PM to the author but not me as I’m not interested and it’s a mute point IMO.


I have participated as a member of the rswarrior forum for over five years because of the passion I’ve developed like many others for the Road* Warrior and to have FUN and meet riders, etc and up to this point it has been a joy.


The main reason I dial in to this site is to learn from others experiences, share, help & pass-on what I can based on facts of what I believe to be accurate information and to always pay homage to those deserving of that respect from which the information came.


I believe my track record speaks for itself and it’s not normally my style to make myself look good at someone’s expense except occasionally in jest and with an Emoticon or J/K.


The information I presented to the author of this post was not, I repeat not on the tip of my tongue nor in my head. I spent considerable time gathering this info.
I researched the Yami Parts Fiche both at MSSS.com and Yamaha Motors for all model years of our bike and just couldn’t understand where the author and his alleged Yamaha sources came up with the later parts fitting the early bikes until he produced the earlier PN that i recognized and described in my 3rd reply after he inserted the NEWinfo. I also then dug out my old spent tab washers (early & late-never conical)again in storage and took jpeg photos that clearly showed the PN's and uploaded them on my Flickr site figuring that this would convince the author and his Yamaha sources that something was rotten! I even provided hyper links from earlier thd's



Funny thing was, i was going to send the 3rd response as a PM to the author to avoid the embarrassment ... oh well


BTW, the thread size is an integral part of the OEM P/N as disclosed by another member in an earlier post so the 22mm was easy pickings. The 1.5 thread pitch was measured from an old middle shaft that I had in storage with hand to hand combat for my 1st reply. The 36mm socket size is a known fact and I have one but the later socket size I found conflicting info and stated such. As it turns out, I believe I was wrong and it’s 30mm (Later)


In each of my responses I challenged the author regarding the accuracy of his info and tried to explain that the tabbed washer is required for the earlier middle shaft and that the conical washer and crush stake nut would not work.


I believe Ken aka Bladerunr even jumped in on this one. I should have known i was in trouble with the topic post label: Middle Drive Gear Question where it should have been Frt pulley nut but i let it slide and said nothing even when the author called the frt pulley the middle drive gear!


The rest is history ….. the author chose to delete his responses and the only finger print/image that remains is what I have high lighted in red in my 1st – 3rd responses. The proof is in the pudding.


And finally, the leather vest remark is really off the wall? where did that come from????


Here’s a Club you might be interested in joining:http://rswarrior.com/forums/t/13277.aspx

They even sell a patch for your leather vest!


After all I have a Big Smile ....







Quote Arizona Warrior, "Let the smart-*** remarks begin . . . I truly don't care."

[*]Ok,leather vests are for Harley Davidson & Road* riders ..... Us SoCal Warriors wouldn't be caught dead in them

[*]And as far as wasting everyone’s time, you’re flattering yourself. The only time wasted was mine as there were only 2 other respondents other then your 9-responses. It's your incorrectly titled topic post that has created all the interest by members here. Very disappointing for them to find out it's a pulley nut and tab washer.[/list]


Arizona Warrior said:
Yep. It figures I even thanked you for nothing. Re-reading everything I can see how it happened.


Arizona Warrior said:
Thanks, I'll use22mm Thd x 1.5p x M36 HexSocket with a 22mm conical spring washer for my 2003.

From the beginningit was clearI was asking about aftermarket availability and its now obvious you already knew it wasn't available in the aftermarket, but you let me spend precious time searching anyway. I let that slide since it seemed likely it was simply a lack of communication, a misunderstanding, and besides what if I stumbled across something new since the last guy searched.


Now its obvious you knew it was back to being a tabbed washer when I'd been saying conical because I believed that yousaid conical.Its sorta funny actually, hindsight is 20/20. I see now how we both mis-interpreted each other. That's okay,it wasn't intentional, but candidly Ifeel let down because it was obvious(because I said it) that I don't have any spares (yet) andI haven't popped the cap off (yet) so you reasonably knew there was no way anyone couldyet translate your hands-on information into real world terms untilgetting hands into that part of the machine. BTW nice pics, lol hehe and etc thanks for drawing me a picture.


There is one thing though.I guess Isorta felt like I was stepping out on a limb in trusting you to play nice in the event of a misunderstanding, valid because you've walked that path often. You and me, we don't communicate. Don't know why. But you sewed the seeds then posted yet another rude snippet.


It also bothers me a little that you've constantly insinuated that since you are 'hands-on' you are better than me. I've been under cars and bikes since I was 13 and I've always had fun even if mistakes were made. I never claimed to be experienced with the Warrior beyond what is posted in my gallery, andI have done all of that work myself,in my driveway, no help, except a few kind souls on this forum who I thanked as we went along. Everything else - you know I referred people to topics posted by members who have successfully done the work - and I let their words speak for them.


In that spirit, I had hoped for clear advise from those who have done this before, butI can see that's not going to happen.So I'll fly solo, with the service manual as my co-pilot and a few trusted posts filed-away inpopular mods for extra navigation. It'll be fine, it always is.


As for this topic, itsdone nothing but waste everyone's time so I'm moving on.


Let the smart-*** remarks begin . . . I truly don't care.


(added): OK,my wife said she loves herleather ride vests because they remind her about places she has seen with her knees in the breeze. Her current vest goes back to2001 when we changedriding clubs over in Arizona. Well, she said your vest remark smells like a lightly-veiled smirk of disapproval, and she said she doesn't much care what you think about vests. She asked about the link for the club you saidI might be interested in joining. Since my middle shaft hasn't failed, I don't qualify (yet) for that club.
 

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'06' & > Front Pulley Nut Socket Size 30mm - Please Confirm

Based on Shivaman's included photo which uses theYamiversion of the naked assy, (adapter platein front of the pulley),i have attempted to accurately scale the jpeg photo to known dimension, such as the 22mmthd size andBC (bolt circle) for mounting the rotating coverwhich is the same as the lightning holes in the stock pulley.


I converted the jpeg file into a tiff file and then inserted the image into acad where i rescaled the image as best as possible.


Based on the enclosed the socket size appears to be a 6-pt 30mm hex






Arizona Warrior said:
While on this topic I'd better post that there are reports for the '06+ models of different hex sizes for the front pulley so everyone might want to checkthe nut size on your bike before assuming you have the right socket!


Re: 06 front pulley nut size?


cmzracing wrote the following post at Thu, Mar 22 2007 4:16 AM


http://rswarrior.com/forums/p/24896/366908.aspx#366908


cmzracing said:
just measured mine on my 06 here at work, def a 30mm. dont know what brand of socket you were checking with, but i just put a Snap-On tools 30mm socket and it fit snug. if your brand socket is from like walmart those cheap brands can fit a little loose when you get up to that size nut.

AlanH wrote the following post at Tue, Jan 20 2009 7:07 PM:


AlanH said:
Arizona Warrior said:
For the Middle Drive Gear -Item #78 - has anyone identified after-market fasteners for Item #79 and Item #80, ormaybe has anyone sketched and dimensioned them (thread/pitch, how thick, ID OD etc) to identify them in the fastener store?
[*]'02-05' : 22mm Thd x 1.5p x M36 HexSocket
[*]'06' & > : 22mm Thd x 1.5p x M32Hex Socket - Your model year differences show M30 nut which i believe is incorrect but i've been wrong before.[/list]
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Re: '06' & > Front Pulley Nut Socket Size 30mm - Please Confirm

The simple answer is, as you know, the unassembled view here is under the heading "Middle Drive Gear" on the Star parts website. The post title wasmeant to give quick access to the Star materials to those who might be able to answer the original question (doknown aftermarket parts exist) and to illustrate the exact parts,which Star includes in the Middle DriveGear drawing.











BTW ifDorman has an aftermarket part for Item #79for 06+ middle shafts that would be great.


AlanH said:
Dorman Productspobably has a matching crush spindle nut that will work withthe newly designed middle shaft assy similar to the enclosed
 

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Middle Shaft Assembly View - '02-05' Transfer Case Open

Arizona Warrior .... It’s great that you now recognize and are pointing out my proper description of the part that you have highlighted in Red for the members. Thank You



Yamaha calls it MIDDLE DRIVEN SHAFT where in reality and the REAL WORLD it is an assembly of 2-parts. Attached to the middle shaft is the 35T MIDDLE DRIVE GEAR, aka Middle Shaft Assy, which is an integral component part of the Secondary Reduction Ratio of the Warrior or what some folks call the Jack Shaft.





Arizona Warrior said:
The simple answer is, as you know, the unassembled view here is under the heading "Middle Drive Gear" on the Star parts website. The post title wasmeant to give quick access to the Star materials to those who might be able to answer the original question (doknown aftermarket parts exist) and to illustrate the exact parts,which Star includes in the Middle DriveGear drawing.





BTW ifDorman has an aftermarket part for Item #79for 06+ middle shafts that would be great.
AlanH said:
Dorman Productspobably has a matching crush spindle nut that will work withthe newly designed middle shaft assy similar to the enclosed
 
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