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Discussion Starter #1
I'm notthe expert on this topic. I've received a couple very kind emailsasking, so here's my thoughts.
Please chime in!


The problem with adjusting the belt slack just to service manual specs is many of us like to race or do burn-outs. Some of us have modified our bikes with1,000# springs,lowering links, wide tire kits.


There are lots of opinions on how to adjust belt slack even on stock bikes. There's probably a lot more opinions for modified bikes, and racing. I read a lot of posts before making my belt adjustment. It seemed to me one 'camp' was sayingif you use a yamaha spring gauge then follow the instructions in the service manual (or owners manual) then its not important to have a rider's weight on the bike. Howeversome othermembers still recommend using the rider's weight. These are not all the posts I read while I was deciding what to do. I justfound these with a quicksearch as examples of the variety of thoughts. Some like it loose, some like it tight.


http://rswarrior.com/forums/t/9942.aspx
http://rswarrior.com/forums/t/23362.aspx
http://rswarrior.com/forums/t/17539.aspx
http://rswarrior.com/forums/t/24146.aspx


I adjusted mine with a buddy in the seat and still used a spring gauge. So I'm posting this to ask for other opinions and to see this topic through fresh eyes.


Like all bikes and cars, the Warrior has a load capacity. Versus a bone-stock bike, the total load of rider passenger luggage and accessories is ~408#. By following all the manual directions plus having even a partial rider's weight on the bike, you put the belt slack more into its operating range in the real world.Some, not all,of us believe we want the belt to be slightly tighter rather than slightly looser. But if its too tight, the front pulley bearing may fail or it may start to leak fluid. If its too loose, the 'snap' of oncoming torque is likely to shock-load the belt and break it clean in two.


- When I'm off the seat, the belt is looser and has more slack.
- When I sit on the seat, the belt is tighter and has less slack.


Members who had a belt snapfound that NOT putting a rider's weight on the bike has the effect of tightening looseningthe belt once they sit on the bike, and its looser tighter under no-load when no harm is done (can't snap a belt if you're not on the seat!). (thanks toalan forcatching that I had this worded backwards)


There are a lot of variables here.For example, if you have an Eibach 1,000# rear spring then your bike won't lower as much when you sit on it, so your belt won't tightenloosen as much when you sit on it. Riders who don't do burn-outs have less to worry about and probably don't need to worry about a rider's weight. The list goes on.


What do you think?
 

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Yes
 

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I run my belt a little loose by the yamaha reccomendations. I am now over 22k with the factory belt. About 4 or 5 burnouts, no racing except playing sometimes with cages.
 

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When I first picked up my Warrior the belt was adjusted as per Yamaha's specs but after reading posts about belt tension on the 4M I have now loosened mine so that I have about 3/4" total slack when sitting on the bike. This is a lot more than Yamaha specs but it works absolutely fine including the odd burnout and fast pull aways including quite a good wheelie once
I remember reading about some guys having about 1 1/2" slack with no problems.


However you end up setting the tension, IMHO the Yamaha specs are way too tight.
 

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Arizona Warrior said:
I'm notthe expert on this topic. I've received a couple very kind emailsasking, so here's my thoughts.
Please chime in!

[*]
Ok, here are the straight facts and not my opinion. The factory manual & forum membership supports the enclosed changes
[/list]


.....................NOT putting a rider's weight on the bike has the effect of loosening the belt once they sit on the bike, and its tighter under no-load when no harm is done.

[*]NOT putting a rider's weight on the bike has the effect ofTIGHTENING the belt once they sit on the bike, and itsLOOSER under no-load when ...........
[/list]


There are a lot of variables here.For example, if you have an Eibach 1,000# rear spring then your bike won't lower as much when you sit on it, so your belt won't loosen as much when you sit on it.

[*]


There are a lot of variables here.For example, if you have an Eibach 1,000# rear spring then your bike won't lower as much when you sit on it, so your belt won'tTIGHTEN as much when you sit on it.[/list]


What do you think?

[*]There is a mountain ofaccurate info on this subject matter available on the forumw/o a response from me


[*]If youconcede to the changes andcorrect your post and i'll delete this response with a BUMP
[/list]
 

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the way i see it is... take a staight edge ( a yard stick maybe ) and align it with the CENTER of the front pulley to the CENTER of the swing arm pivot. sit on the bike.


now, if your swingarm "angles" below the straight edge, the belt will tighten when sat on ( until the swingarm angle is equal to the straight edge - this is the tightest the belt will be, if this is the case, i would set the slack " on the looser side" - the farther from the "line" , the looser the slack, the closer to the "line", the tighter the slack (up to what the manual says).

if your swingarm is equal to or higher than the line, possibly due to weight or being lowered, the belt will loosen when sat on . if this is the case i would set the slack to "manual specs ", as the belt will loosen when sat on and over big bumps. hope this makes sense . comes down to simple geometry

if the center if the front pulley was the same as the swingarm pivot ( which it is not ) there would be no differance of tension of the belt weather you sat on the bike or not
 

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Discussion Starter #7



HeckI knew what I meant to say, but I didn't say it and rushing to get out the door is no excuse!I typedit backwards and you caught it. I re-worded the entire paragraph to make it more clear (I lined-out the error spots). Your offer isn't necessary, this forum isn't a debate to me, it's a sharing of ideas. There's no need to concede or post a bump. Those who actually know me know I'd have been just as red-facedwhen I read my own post later,even if nobody caught it. Look at it this way: thanks to you, it got corrected earlier. That's a good thing.


AlanH said:
If youconcede to the changes andcorrect your post and i'll delete this response with a BUMP

Considering thesubject,I'm not alone in the feelingthe past postsrepresenting the'mountain of accurate information' are irrelevant anddo not generally deal with the variables (such as 1,000# springs)that are part of the subject here. Besides its too time-consuming to weed thru old posts and figure out what is right for a bike with (x) mods, or if it even changes anything. And I know, I've plowed thru plenty of them.


This subject has interest. There's new and old members with experience and opinions. Let's see where it takes us, I have my eyes and mind open to new thoughts on this since it might save me a couple hundred on a broken belt on tour!


 

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Coming back from the Dealer my belt was tight....surprise surprise!! Withthe bikeon the lift, there's a good half inch of slack at least and I try to run almost that when I'm on the bike. I don't do burn-outs or race but I do have 125ft/lbs which I like to use:} No trouble yet at 32,000 miles.
 

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Here is my experience.


1000lb spring and shortened dog bones


On the stock belt I did about 600 wheelies in 30k. I never had a problem and always put the rear tire on as it was from the factory. I never checked the tension thru numerous tire changes.


I subscribed to "looser the better" attitude that many have.


The stock belt finally failed so I bought a Polychain. I installed it without a gauge and set the tension on the loose side. It lasted two days. I purchased a Yamaha belt and set it even looser. It lasted a few hundred miles.


I bought another Polychain and Roadstar pulleys as well as a tension gauge. I set the tension as it is stated in the manual and in 6k have had no issues.


I "think" that you have to find the sweet spot. if you put the belt on so loose that it wraps under heavy load it will fail. If you put it on over tight it will snapas well.
 

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This is an important thread so I hope more folks offer their opinions. Nobody wants a squeaking pully or a broken belt.


Iinstalled a modified relay arm (flip and grind) and noticed the tension wasmuch tighter than before. I adjusted the tension based on feel even though I realize this is a critical adjustment but I didnt have a gauge. My goal was to get the tension as close to spec as possible. I would like to hear more on this subject.
 

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I adjust my belt with either rider weight or the equilvent on the seat. I use a gauge to adjust the tension to factory specs. If I'm going to error, or if I I don't have access to all I need, I will error on the side of too tight rather than too loose. I tried going a little looser with all the extra torque I'm putting out and I snapped three belts. I believe there is more tension on the belt when the slack gets pulled out of the belt on acceleration. After leaning toward the tight side, I've got probably 18k or more on a gates without breaking one. That being said, if what you are doing is working for you, don't fix it
 

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Arizona Warrior said:
HeckI knew what I meant to say, but I didn't say it and rushing to get out the door is no excuse!I typedit backwards and you caught it. I re-worded the entire paragraph to make it more clear (I lined-out the error spots). Your offer isn't necessary, this forum isn't a debate to me, it's a sharing of ideas. There's no need to concede or post a bump. Those who actually know me know I'd have been just as red-facedwhen I read my own post later,even if nobody caught it. Look at it this way: thanks to you, it got corrected earlier. That's a good thing.


AlanH said:
If youconcede to the changes andcorrect your post and i'll delete this response with a BUMP
Arizona Warrior ...not to highjack this post but my offer to delete and bump the prior post was only to add clearity without any confusion to youroriginal authored post. My only concern here wastheconfusion to the uninformed & less knowledgeable membership of the rswarrior community and nothing more.


Since you chose to pontificate your actions at my expense we will let it lie as is
 

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Ok here is my take as I just broke a stock belt,17 k miles on belt, Installed Gates Poly Chain.


Because the axel travles in an arc as the swing arm moves it changes the belt tension.With the bikeon the lift platformfrontwheel in the clamp/stop with the forks compressed down 1 inch with tiedowns. Then installed aratchet tiedown strap across the seat anchoreddown on each side of the bike,used rolled up towels for padding. I pulled down strap until axel and swing arm pivot bolt were level,strait across from each other. This is the point the belt is the tightest,rear pulley is the farthest in its travle arc. At this point I set the belt tension to 1/4 inch with 10 lbs. pull. I say pull because I use a spring scale hooked to a tyrap around the belt.With this way of setting the tension,kind of backing in to it, I found the tension to be @ 3/8 inch. with just my weight on the bike and a little over 1/2 inch when she is on the kick stand.


I didn't want the belt too tightwhen the bike sets down under power.BWT the front drive pulley made from 2 piece construction are crap.Too much runout.U might get a good one or U might not.Checking the pulley alignment is a nother can of worms.
 

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AlanH said:
Since you chose to pontificate your actions at my expense we will let it lie as is

don't stop 'pontifcating' guys please!- this an enormous help to us newbies and much appreciated and thanks AlanH for the 'devil's in the detail' - don't you stop either, we need all the help we can get on this subject - as AzW says it can be an expensive mistake - need to divide this into settings from stock to 'big mod rides' when the results are in - cheers
[from a guy who knows nothing about this subject, all i can do is cheer!]
 

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I have tried a few different techniques to tighten my belt. From using a tension gauge to hand setting.

The main thing I am trying to focus on is the front pulley shaft and bearing. I would almost rather break a belt than hurt that bearing (I think)


I work with the distinct 'feel' in the belt when either tight or slack, you can feel the stretch when it is applied. That being said, I adjust the belt with no weight on the bike and then adjust for that 'feel'. Twisting the belt a little helps to feel this 'tension level' even more. It winds up at approx 3/4 inch.


My bike has 900# Eibach

I weigh 165#

Bike is lowered with Ram396 kit

I don't do burnouts, but am willing to snap the throttle a bit

I do not know how to do wheelies (there I admitted it....lol)


Most riding is steady throttle roll, (but it's a warrior, so the roll-on can be rather agressive)

11k miles and the belt seems fine

I too would welcome comments on the way I am doing this. Should I be more concerned with the belt than the pulley and shaft/bearing? I imagine the belt snapping could damage more than just the belt, but having to replace that bearing and/or shaft seems a bit 'deep' and seems like it would lead to more issues internally.


Good thread! Keep 'em coming!!!!!!
 

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Discussion Starter #18
We're two very different people is all, and I feel badifyou felt I was beingat-odds because my'thank you' wasn't intended to be confrontational. Again, thanks for the good catch, I would have been more red-faced
(embarrassed) ifsomeone had time to use the reversed info before I re-read my post and saw myobvious error.


AlanH said:
not to highjack this post but my offer to delete and bump the prior post was only to add clearity without any confusion to youroriginal authored post. My only concern here wastheconfusion to the uninformed & less knowledgeable membership of the rswarrior community and nothing more. Since you chose to pontificate your actions at my expense we will let it lie as is
 

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To better understand what is going on with this belt/swing arm travel tension thing.....


My bike was used in the movie Torque and still has the camera indexing point on the top left side of the swing arm. I am going to barrow a small movie camera from a bud who used it in his race car mountedinside the car from the roll cage. Should be able to see the belt flex and possibly even the way it tracks on the pulleys under power..IMO it is worth a shot..


I know at times my spelling sucks..I went to school here in California in the late 50's through the 60's and I am a product of a reading experiment that went bad. They found we could learn to read very fast but could NOT spell for Sh#* ! I know,spell check right?I do and still miss somewords some how.


Mike-warriordude
 
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