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Sidecar anyone!?!?!?!

3K views 25 replies 12 participants last post by  Heftysmurf 
#1 ·
Well finally got around to doing some more modifications to Yoshi. Havent seen many sidecars on these bikes so of course I had to go that route!

Its not done yet but it was such a nice day, plus Bowser is being a little punk and stopped running, got things tweeked for the most part so the bike runs straight down the road. Never got it over 30 today just some round the block stints and stopping to adjust things.

I made a subframe and bolted it to the bike in a few places, the rear shock mount, the rear passenger pegs and stock muffler mounts, front foot pegs, front motor mounts.

Anyways I do have some questions for you folks that are wayyyy more knowledgeable than me. The sidecar swing arm and shock are stock warrior but I took out all the linkages/dogbones on the shock. It seems so light weight like the spring seems really light. Do those linkages help some how mechanically to make the shock stiffer, thinking something like how a block and tackle makes a heavy load feel light?

Also I want to stick a rear brake caliper on the sidecar. I was thinking to just use a longer banjo bolt on the rear master cylinder and double it up there. So one brake line to the bike rear brake and 1 to the sidecar brake. I know there is something to do with sizing of master cylinders and all so you think this would be an issue?
 

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#20 ·
I've got to follow this. Very interesting. Wish I could help, as far as knowledge goes, but I got nothing.

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That looks like an old Zundap sidecar from World War 2 ( you remember WW2, it was in all the papers ). When I saw a Warrior made into a trike I thought yes nice not too bad. Now I see this sidecar caper I’m interested to see how it will look when finished. I have wondered myself what a 1938 Indian Chief sidecar would look on a Warrior. With the leaf spring suspension it pointed up really high until someone got in lol😎😎🐝
 
#6 ·
…. The sidecar swing arm and shock are stock warrior but I took out all the linkages/dogbones on the shock. It seems so light weight like the spring seems really light. Do those linkages help some how mechanically to make the shock stiffer...……..?
  • Yes they do Monty. The Forces lost can be calculated using Trigonometry. A single line cad dwg with angles, pivot points etcetera would be req'd << AlanH
Also I want to stick a rear brake caliper on the sidecar. I was thinking to just use a longer banjo bolt on the rear master cylinder and double it up there. So one brake line to the bike rear brake and 1 to the sidecar brake. I know there is something to do with sizing of master cylinders and all so you think this would be an issue?
  • Monty, Not a good idea imho. Hydraulic Fluid like Electricity flows to the point of least resistance. Also, the long brake line, to the side car, will have a negative affect on the height of the rear brake pedal because of the additional cubic inches of brake fluid. Using a small steel brake line where possible will help some too.
  • Up sizing the Rear MC piston diameter would resolve the low pedal but the Effective Forces will be lower at the caliper pistons because the generated hydraulic pressure (PSI) will be lower with the larger bore MC that has more square inches.
    • There is info available in the forum by this writer regarding ramifications when modifying these component sizes and mechanical Forces.
  • I would expect that the side car could use a smaller diameter rotor, caliper piston and pads as well as its own MC to help balance the load. Also a proportional and metering device.
  • If all you want to do is go around the block or to the corner grocery store then anything will work. When it comes to real everyday riding and a panic stop then you'll want to properly design the system for the worst condition imo.
  • An electrically operated brake might be an easier approach but perhaps more money. Don't know!
When time permits I'll see if I can dig-up the old threads if you want. Just let me know.
 
#7 ·
Thanks for the info Alan! Always good to hear from you.

I have been talking to guys on a sidecar forum and asking opinions and in general getting pointers and tips on everything from driving to set up to brakes.

It seems there are 3 camps when it comes to brakes on the sidecar.
no brakes
brakes that are separate with a separate brake pedal and MC
and those that tap off their bikes rear brakes to the side car brake

No matter which camp they all agree the sidecar brake needs to be the "weak" brake.

I think for the time being I am going to go with no sidecar brake. I just took the sidecar off so I can finish some gussets and other loose ends.

In the future, if I decide to stay with a sidecar, I think to try to go with a brake that is tapped off the bikes rear brake and use a proportioning valve, like this one Wilwood 260-8419: Proportioning Valve Knob Adjust | JEGS

Its all an experiment and learning experience for me so I am open to any links you have time to dig up. I am going to research some electric brakes also.

Thanks for the info on the rear shock also! I had a sneaky suspicion that the dogbones somehow "helped" the spring but alas that was just me looking at things and thinking. I have no real knowledge in the area to say for sure it did.
 
#9 ·
have to follow this one. wish I could help. I would check out bikes with dual disc brakes and see how they are hooked up and then go the same route. Maybe put a proportioning valve , one that is adjustable in so you can adjust the two rear brakes
 
#12 ·
How about finding one of Urals and just mount it to the bike?


Just throwing as an idea ;)
I have a Ural and another side car I can attach to it or another 7 bikes I could attach a side car to.. Thats not the point. I see everyone putting wide tires and polishing things its the same thing over and over. Then debating about what oil to use and what tires are best and so on and so on.

I want to do something different. If for no other reason than to see if I am inventive enough to get it done. This bike and I have been all over the world and its time to change it up. Will it work out long term, I dont know. Will it be an adventure and I learn a lot, yup.

Anyone can go buy a Ural or what ever and "customize" it with mass produced aftermarket parts. I want an actual custom bike thats used not stroked and polished so it looks cool but is a work horse and a blast to ride.
 
#14 ·
Well got the sidecar frame gusseted and painted up with some truck bed liner. Cant say I am to happy with it. 2 days of 70F temperature and the bed liner just never really set up... Still havent done anything for a side car brake. Had the nephew and niece help me turn some old couch cushions into a seat in the side car. May not be cool but will work for the time being and maybe they will learn a thing or 2.

Would like to get it painted but I have to many things going on... So will stay as it is for a while and ride when I can!
 

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#18 ·
Some updates. the exhaust I got was just a stock header with a slip on. It was freaking loud. I made a baffle for it and put that in.
Automotive tire Motor vehicle Thigh Helmet Personal protective equipment
Ohh its so much better! If I got someone in the sidecar and going slow we can even have a conversation. Then the battery was about done and i had this car battery laying around from a car that the engine blew. So make a box for it out of junk I had laying around and a spare fender that the previous guy had cut way down.
Automotive tire Plant Motor vehicle Tire Window
Automotive exterior Bumper Motor vehicle Electrical wiring Computer hardware
Needless to say I dont have to worry about if the battery is strong enough haha. Also put the skid bars and light from a tank on the front of the sidecar. Lights are not wired up yet but my goal was to just get them on the bike
Tire Wheel Automotive tire Automotive lighting Motor vehicle
 
#19 ·
SUPER interesting! Gonna follow this one!

I just read about the discussions about brakes and had a thought (and a challenge) for you. Since it's a good idea to have them isolated from the bike's brake systems, what if you were able to use a trailer tongue's "automatic" brakes? If the sidecar was able to apply stress to a specific member during braking, make that member a telescoping member with the brake master cylinder attached to either side. That way, as you apply the brakes on the bike, the sidecar shifts forward ever so slightly and applies the brakes on the side car. No thinking about proportioning or what kind of weight is in the sidecar as it would automatically adjust based on how much stress the sidecar applies on the telescoping member and proportionately applies the correct braking force.

I'll try to draw up something later tonight if you or anyone else is interested. I know you're a bit far into your build to really even worry about this, but I like your attitude of making something new. I wish I had the time and tools to take on projects like this so for now, I live vicariously through the talented riders like yourself with the necessary resources to undergo these types of transformations.

Just an idea from a like minded inventor. ;)
 
#21 ·
SUPER interesting! Gonna follow this one!

That is a good idea but I am not sure. The biggest thing to overcome on the sidecar addition is you want the sidecar to be attached good and not move. otherwise you get a lot of unpredictability out of it. With that said they do make sidecars that lean so you can still drive the bike like a bike but leaning side to side is not nearly as upsetting to your riding style as the bike moving forward and backwards.
There is a lot of "rules" to attaching a sidecar to get a decently ridable rig. Believe it or not the placement of the sidecar wheel between the front and back bike wheels is pretty important. Plus the side car wheel is slightly towed in towards the side car.
I would have to think on it more and if it is possible with out the sidecar actually moving forward and back. I have played with the thing trying to see how the position of the sidecar tire affects handling and so far where I got it set has been the best combination
 
#24 ·
I dont know if I will do any music, I am not a fan of music on motorcycles. But in general there is going to be some things added to it just looking for the right bits and bobs. Trying to do things cheap and custom taking parts from things and adding them where they fit :) I really want to make a leading link front end for it next and use the rear tire on the front that way all the tires match! That would be a site to see!!
 
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