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My freind has an 04 V-star with about 4k on the odie. He wants to use synthetic oil but was told by the dealer that he can't use it as it will cause his seals to leak. I told him I've never heard of such a thing but all that means is that I've never heard of such a thing. Figured I'd ask here where the real knowledge is. So can this be true?
 

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Unless he has crappy seals from the factory- this is complete crap... Bugs me how guys in dealerships (especially mechanics) should know better but don't...


Synthetic won't cause a seal to leak, it could expose a bad seal but even then consider it doing you a favor by showing you the leak as it has to be pretty bad to actually seep or leak.
 

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I agree that it is total BS. If anything you will burnthe oilwith a higher mileage engine because of the different viscosity of synthetic when it is hot and having worn rings etc.. but I have never heard anything about it damaging seals. I learned that the hard way.. aJiffy type oil change place"sold" me on synthetic oil.. for my truck with 180,000 miles or so on it.... ended up loosing half the oil and bringing it back only to be told by one of the other guys that you should never use synthetic in high mileage engines.
 

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Before I got the warrior I had a 98 v-star which I purchased new. I ran dino oils in it until about 4k miles and then switched to mobil 1. I never had a problem with oil seals. I sold the bike to my neighbor in 06 with about 11k on it. It now has about 18k on it and still no problems with oil seals. Your dealer needs to stop spreading old myths.
 

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jabo said:
Your dealer needs to stop spreading old myths.

That's it right there, this one goes way back... I remember a few decades ago people switching and saying they found this to be the case but the only two specific cases I recall were both old very high mileage vehicles who very likely had bad seals anyway.
 

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My car has 180,000 miles on it and the bike has 25,000 miles. I have done every oil change myself with synthetic. No leaks no problem. I have heard that after years of accumulated gunk from dino oil, that switching to synth will clean it up. If the gunk was the only thing holding the engine together, then synthetic oil may reveal a problem.
 

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According to Yamaha - thru 2007 model years -the V-Star 650 and 1100 have two aliased-rubber o-rings that require dino-lube to stay flexible which is why synthetic isn't recommended and those of you who know me know I'm lying out my *** just for fun!
Seriously, this synth is fine for all bikes per Star:


http://www.starmotorcycles.com/star/yamalube.aspx


BTW my understanding is this 15-50 syntheticallows you to avoid the new seasonal-oil recommendation Yamaha has adopted in order to extend the life of oil pumps. There's an oiltopic discussing this on this forum someplace, it appears the 20-40 remains too thick in most regions during winter temperatures. The owner and service manuals have always saiduse 20-40 above 40-deg F (5-deg C). But now, for dino, there will soon be a summer-oil (20-50) and a winter oil (10-40) and I gather the '09 manual does a better job of recommending the different viscocity for winter but I haven't seen one yet. I still have enough Yamalube4 for one oil channgeand after that I need to stock-up on a case of something again. I figure I might use synth to avoid over-taxing the oil oump when riding in winters. Even if we head back to AZ it gets very cold some winters there too, but not often!


For Yami/Star Synth - see also:


http://www.starmotorcycles.com/star/apparel/apscitemdetail/3/121/all/1/7452/detail.aspx






Yamalube® 15W-50 Full Synthetic with Ester (JASO MA)





Our full synthetic oil blended with esters* for increased lubrication is our best performance oil for motorcycles, ATV's, and Side x Sides. This special blend uses the cleanest, highest quality ashless detergents and the best additive package our engineering team could design. With so much technology in this oil, it could only come from the technology leader - Yamaha. If you demand the best, this is it! This oil meets or exceeds the requirements of JASO MA**.

*The highest grade of lubricants are known as esters. These lubricants are fully synthetic and provide unequalled lubricity that bonds with metal engine components creating a shield against wear.

**JASO (Japanese Automotive Standards Organization) defines and publishes motorcycle and automotive standards. JASO MA is the highest certified rating of motorcycle engine oil used with wet, multi-plate clutches. All Yamalube products listed here meet or exceed the JASO MA1 standard - the best for motorcycle engines.
 

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First off, I build alot of engines and have seen what effect different oils do to engines. That doesn't mean what I am about to say is gosphel but it is how I feel based on evidence I have pwersonally witnessedso here goes.


A guy I build for races 2 classes, late model and b mod. Late model rules allow you to use synth and b mod doesnt. His late model engine had 54 nites on it. That is 2 years of foot to the floor and 8900 rpms of pure abuse and he figured it was time to rebuild. His b mod only had 2 nites on it and was running fine but wanted the cam changed because it wasn't pulling out of the corners the way he wanted it to. Both motors were side by side on stands and the one with synth and 54 nites on it was cleaner on the inside than the one with dyno and 2 nites. The synth was mobil 1 and the dyno was mobil. Dont get me wrong, the b mod motor was pretty clean too, but what I learned from that was the synth held up way better to the heat and abuse than the dyno did. I simply will not cook under the high heat and stain the block.


On another note, if mobil 1 is good enuff for the good ol USA to use in its nuclear submarines I think it will be good enuff for my f150 and my warrior.


After all of that being said, its your bike so use what you feel comfortable with. With the tecnology we have today I believe all of the oils we have to choose from will do a fine job as long as you follow the maintenance scedule and change it regularly.
 

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This an old myth. And it is just that, a myth.

If you have an engine with high miles and poor maintenance, you will have sludge. Sludge will actuall mask degraded seals by plugging up the leaks, when you introduce synthetic oils with extremely lage amounts of detergents in their additive package, you will be shown where your seals have degrade by finding leaks.

If you have an engine in good repair, maintained properly, with servicable seals, you will not find leaks after the switch, no matter what the mileage. This applies to all quality synthetic brands.

Some of the oldest ester based synthetics did attack certain types of gasket/seal material, these formulations are to the best of my knowlege gone by about 15-20 years or so, and there is only one company still using ester base stock in their synthetics AFAIK.

Amsoil uses a full group IV PAO base stock, and actually has seal conditioning additives in the additive packages to help better maintain seals and extend their service life better than other brands.



Hope this helps, let me know if I can answer any other questions.



Ashton
 

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99venom said:
First off, I build alot of engines and have seen what effect different oils do to engines. That doesn't mean what I am about to say is gosphel but it is how I feel based on evidence I have pwersonally witnessedso here goes.


A guy I build for races 2 classes, late model and b mod. Late model rules allow you to use synth and b mod doesnt. His late model engine had 54 nites on it. That is 2 years of foot to the floor and 8900 rpms of pure abuse and he figured it was time to rebuild. His b mod only had 2 nites on it and was running fine but wanted the cam changed because it wasn't pulling out of the corners the way he wanted it to. Both motors were side by side on stands and the one with synth and 54 nites on it was cleaner on the inside than the one with dyno and 2 nites. The synth was mobil 1 and the dyno was mobil. Dont get me wrong, the b mod motor was pretty clean too, but what I learned from that was the synth held up way better to the heat and abuse than the dyno did. I simply will not cook under the high heat and stain the block.


On another note, if mobil 1 is good enuff for the good ol USA to use in its nuclear submarines I think it will be good enuff for my f150 and my warrior.


After all of that being said, its your bike so use what you feel comfortable with. With the tecnology we have today I believe all of the oils we have to choose from will do a fine job as long as you follow the maintenance scedule and change it regularly.
I do remember the Mobil 1 sitting on the pier, but I don't remember what it was used in, I know the turbines used 2190 TEP (MIL-PRF-17331) a Chevron/Texaco product. Does anyone else remember? It might have been in the HiPacs.
 
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