[MarcoPolo]

What can you expert types tell me about the S&SX-Wedge that I might not have already read? I'm considering a 114" X-Wedge option for my next bike and I'd like to hear more pros and cons. I'm not looking forward to the limited exhaust options but I think I can get around that. What impact are the coming EPA regulations really going to have in the real world that might make it more worth it? The performance of it looks solid and I see the architectual benefits built into it but does anyone have firsthand experience on the "feel" of it? What makes it the route to go, and even more importantly, what reasons might there be to completely avoid it??

 

[tomba]

What can you expert types tell me about the S&SX-Wedge

Gee marco.. now i'm going to have to look up X- wedge just to understand what you guys are going to be talking about!!?? [would have been shorter to 'bump' but you know me]

 

[Meatball]

Well you could listen to my opinion........or some guys who're supposed to know better.


http://www.cycleworld.com/article.asp?section_id=3&article_id=240

 

[tomba]

Ok.. i watched x-wedge.com s&s comp...[that was was quite some show]....hmmmm what do you want to know? other than you'll need a wholebig bike to put it in!!..perhaps a warrior!?

 

[Meatball]

It bears a lot of similarities to the Warrior Engine. Especially the crank and rods. They make good arguments for everything they did, but limited production numbers always make me nervous. I'll run it by a Millwright, HD engine builder fanatic buddy of mine and see what he says and report back. He WILL have an opinion.

 

[Meatball]

http://www.motorcycle-usa.com/313/1462/Motorcycle-Article/S-S-Reveals-Innovative-X-Wedge-Engine.aspx


One nuther good one.

 

[Pep]

"X" Wedge? Isn't that the one that goes between the sand wedge and the lob wedge?

 

[allsmiles]

No Pep, X Wedge is what the ex-wife and ex-girlfriend do to you when they see you out in public with your new woman.

 

[MarcoPolo]

Well, at 56 degrees that may be almost right depending on your bag. This wedge could certainly power out of a bunker I'm sure.


Thanks for the links Meatball. I had read the first one before but the second one was still pretty useful to me even though a lot of it is info from the x-wedge site. I don't really see any faults with it from everything I read about it but I'm wondering about that three cam belt driven design and if there really isreduced vibrations overall in addition to the low engine noise. I've ridden on their 100" BBC proprietary standard 45 degree motor and it was incredibly still even at idle so it's hard to imagine the X-Wedge improving that part. Another thing I like is the closed loop VFI system with all the sensors everywhere including exhaust probes to auto-adjust the ECU map on the fly. Then again, as we all know, if notengineered well those same sensors could put you on the side of the road.

 

[sin_city_warrior]

I see in that article in comes in BLACK. That is too cool.

 

[Meatball]

Well Lynn got back to me, all he said was that it didn't fit in an HD frame and was just for custome builds. (HD riders, what did I expect?).


I wondered about the belt driven cams too, but there's been belt driven cams around for a couple of decades......no it's longer than that, the old gold wings had belt driven cams.

 

[arizonawarrior]

They have been around since 2007-2008.


The x-wedge motors are not counterbalanced.

 

[MarcoPolo]

The first one (Fred) was completed and tested in Dec '04 andthefirst put in an actual prototype (Wilma)was Spring '05 but it seems it's been a slow road getting custom builders andbuyers to accept (and pay for) something so different. I was hoping by now even with the limited numbers of them out there I could get some real world feedback however. One article I read said they aren't counterbalanced because it would detract from the asthetics although they kept the option available but another article I read said it wasn't needed because of the new design changes. It seems everything I read is from early '07 and is basically just press release type info and not unbiased comparison test type articles. The closest one for me to test ride is almost 400 miles away so I figured I'd see if I could get lucky and one of you have practical experience with it. I'm not concerned about it not fitting in a Harley frame, it's going to be in a BBC if that's what I decide to go with. Thanks for checking with him Meatball.

 

[Bladerunr]

I guess I'm just not seeing it.


What was the new part??


Looks like a rehash of conventional design to me

 

[arizonawarrior]

The only one I saw seemed to vibrate quite a lot. This one doesn't seem to:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x1SR5MEZTNA&feature=related


Maybe it just doesn't show up in this vid?

 

[MarcoPolo]

Looks like a rehash of conventional design to me

I don't know that I'd call it as simple as a "rehash" but yes, the goal was tokeep with an air-cooledV-Twin motor that is more current and better capable of performing at the sizes people desire nowadays while also improving performance using proven race industry ideas and still exceeding future EPA and California emissions standards.

What was the new part??

There are several changes made detailed in the articles and their site, give them a read. The most obvious right off the bat is the switch from 45 to 56.25 degrees to allow for more room for the fins (and everything else for that matter) which have become increasingly smaller over the years as the cylinderskeep growing (basically crowding them out). Another is the one piece forged crankshafts and plain bearings used lessening the number of moving parts and increasing the amount of load capable of being handled with the added strength. Some of the changes like those were automotive inspired from Formula One and have been implemented in drag racing as well. Larger pushrod tubes like the Warrior improve oil flow and crankcase preasure but the rods themself are one-piece non-adjustable which is supposedly another improvement and vibration and noise killer. There are several significant changes compared to the standard piston design as well and the combustion chamber configuration is entirely different to provide several advantages including less noise and vibration againbut alsobetter efficiency and reliability.


I don't think anyone at S&S is claiming all of these changes are completely revolutionary and being used for the first time (because they aren't) but it's the first motorcycle motor that has implemented all of them in one family of motors that eliminate most of the restrictions that plauged and limited the standard air-cooled v-twin design from the past. S&S made performance replacement parts for years before making performance engines so it makes sense that they would be the one to incorporate all that engineeringand come up with the next generation motor I guess.


What I'D still like to know though, is how it really does and what are the shortcomings and pitfalls of it. You know it has some, everything does. I just want to know what they are so I can weigh the pros and cons BEFORE I spend the dough on it.

 

[Bladerunr]

OK, sounds like you've got it bad.

Might as well get one, if it's what you want. No point in trying to justify our toys. As for "pitfalls", only time and miles will tell.


Be SURE to post up when you get one, because I'll be standing in line to have a look, and a listen.

 

[MarcoPolo]

No point in trying to justify our toys. As for "pitfalls", only time and miles will tell.

Yeah, I'm just nervous about this whole purchase due to the price involved and I'm hoping someone ELSES time and miles can tell me before I get any deeper. I just don't want to buy into it doing everything it's hyped to do if it really isn't the right choice but I think you're right. I think I might just have to bite the bullet and find out for myself possibly. I've already accepted the fact that I'll lose a ton in resale but I don't want to compound my losses if I can help it. That's just me though, I take 30 minutes looking at a menu only to decide on a cheeseburger. lol


And oh I'm sure I'll post up when I get something even though I'm pretty sure how most people will respond anyway. We're going looking at 3 or 4 this weekend but it's doubtful we'll buy one yet even though I'd like to get something before the tax increase April 1st.

 

[mxjrb_651]

http://www.jaylenosgarage.com/video/video_player.shtml?vid=201499



This clip actually has some good info on it. Of course it sounds like they are reading right outta the catalog. But its still cool either way! Good luck with your decision.

 

[MarcoPolo]

Nice clip and a pretty decent review of actual ride experience, thank you. They didn't really show much of the exhaust but I sure liked that sound and it was good to hear him confirm thingsconcerning the vibration and engine noise (Victorys are terrible about this) actually being much less just like I've been hoping. I think I'm sold and the best part is, the wife is on board with the extra cost because it's EPA friendly also.